Zasel, What exactly are you objecting to. A family fraudulently sponging off the tax-payers or those trying to protect the program to serve the poor, not free-loaders that CHOSE not to self-insure themselves.

I think the crucial point is that this child was used by the Democrats as propaganda. The Dems are the ones responsible for the current bill being vetoed. This child was still able to use the program and many other children are still able to use the program.
So, what is the problem? Are you so bigoted against the poor in this country that you think they only exist to expand programs to those that do not need them.

It is time to stand up for those less fortunate in this country ...

Zasel, What exactly are you objecting to. A family fraudulently sponging off the tax-payers or those trying to protect the program to serve the poor, not free-loaders that CHOSE not to self-insure themselves.

I think the crucial point is that this child was used by the Democrats as propaganda. The Dems are the ones responsible for the current bill being vetoed. This child was still able to use the program and many other children are still able to use the program.
So, what is the problem? Are you so bigoted against the poor in this country that you think they only exist to expand programs to those that do not need them.

It is time to stand up for those less fortunate in this country and quit using them as pawns. The current program needs to be funded, not expanded. In fact, the need is smaller now than it was when the Bill was introduced.

Willhelm, I have learned through the years that there are those people who really DO want to discuss issues, and then their are those who wish to just throw-up the same claptrap that is regurgitated constantly ad nauseum on the Internet et al. Everyone who does not agree with the right-wingers are socialists out to destroy the precious free market of America which should always have the right to run rampant without any controls whatsoever. If you believe this, that's you're right.

They shlep out wounded war veterans, a la Arie Fleisher and use them as pawns for their political advertising and then lambaste a 12 year- old- child who is talking about how Schip has helped his family. In other...

Willhelm, I have learned through the years that there are those people who really DO want to discuss issues, and then their are those who wish to just throw-up the same claptrap that is regurgitated constantly ad nauseum on the Internet et al. Everyone who does not agree with the right-wingers are socialists out to destroy the precious free market of America which should always have the right to run rampant without any controls whatsoever. If you believe this, that's you're right.

They shlep out wounded war veterans, a la Arie Fleisher and use them as pawns for their political advertising and then lambaste a 12 year- old- child who is talking about how Schip has helped his family. In other words, what the right-wingers do and say is fine, because, in their view they are protecting America from us socialist lefties. But if we even dare to employ a shadow of their tactics, all kinds of crap is thrown at us.

In udder woids my friend. Youse guys just do not play fair. Call that naive of me, or anything else you may wish to say. But I will NOT continue to engage in these alleged conversations that only lead to me and people with similar beliefs being labeled as some kind of socialist or heinous threat to the good of the country. And you and your buddies can continue to rant as you wish among yourselves and proclaim the glory of the Iraq war, the rampant lack of any control of the free market, the need to rid the country of people who are not poor enough to be in poverty, but just don't have the means to afford health insurance in this country, or anything else you care to believe. But I am through with anyone who is simply going to use me as a pulpit for their own one-sided views on the pretext that they really want to constructively discuss issues.

Your curiosity about my feelings behind this "event", will just have to go unsatisfied.

Everyone who does not agree with the right-wingers are socialists out
to destroy the precious free market of America which should always have
the right to run rampant without any controls whatsoever. If you
believe this, that's you're right.

I do not believe that. A quick survey of my clips will clearly show that I do not engage in the hateful rhetoric of you and Debbyski. Please, Have a look!

Your curiosity about my feelings behind this "event", will just have to go unsatisfied.

It seems to me that by your rant you are just deflecting. I am just seeking, AS I ALWAYS DO DESPITE YOUR RHETORIC, a POINT of CLARITY.

I take it you choose rather to spout bigoted an...

Everyone who does not agree with the right-wingers are socialists out
to destroy the precious free market of America which should always have
the right to run rampant without any controls whatsoever. If you
believe this, that's you're right.

I do not believe that. A quick survey of my clips will clearly show that I do not engage in the hateful rhetoric of you and Debbyski. Please, Have a look!

Your curiosity about my feelings behind this "event", will just have to go unsatisfied.

It seems to me that by your rant you are just deflecting. I am just seeking, AS I ALWAYS DO DESPITE YOUR RHETORIC, a POINT of CLARITY.

I take it you choose rather to spout bigoted and incorrect views about my views. Fine. I suppose your not really all that disgusted.

Every time I believe the right-wing nutters have reached their bottom
when it comes to smear tactics, I find myself being shocked back into
reality

Whassa matter, never learned how to argue without MAKING THINGS UP?

attacking a 12-year-old boy

Show me anywhere any of those people attacked the 12 YEAR OLD BOY!!! And DON'T LIE ! The leftists have a new, repeating template of reacting when they CANNOT answer the charges made.They/YOU have taken to falsely charging opponents as having smeared and attacked innocent victims. The truth being that the leftists have first made a victim of the individuals in question;then others expose that victimization; followed by le...

Every time I believe the right-wing nutters have reached their bottom
when it comes to smear tactics, I find myself being shocked back into
reality

Whassa matter, never learned how to argue without MAKING THINGS UP?

attacking a 12-year-old boy

Show me anywhere any of those people attacked the 12 YEAR OLD BOY!!! And DON'T LIE ! The leftists have a new, repeating template of reacting when they CANNOT answer the charges made.They/YOU have taken to falsely charging opponents as having smeared and attacked innocent victims. The truth being that the leftists have first made a victim of the individuals in question;then others expose that victimization; followed by leftists charging that it is in fact those others who have victimized the subjects. And they do it loudly and indignantly. What a pssv./aggrsv. tactic befitting a 10 yr.old!
SHOW ME where any of those people you mention do ANYTHING but point out how YOU/the LEFT has used and victimized this child. And stick to the individual argument. Don't argue the SCHIP merits. Only make the argument that those you mentioned attacked THE KID and NOT the ones behind the ad! SHOW ME.

Ok Willie, I will, in fairness you must remember I was not even referring to my reasons for supporting the program, but I was incensed by the way the right chose to jump on this kid and his family by claiming to dig up information about them that has been proven to be false. The father does not own a highly profitable business. They do not have an income near what was claimed, and the kids are not going to outrageously expensive private schools paid for by the wealth of the family. Some on the right, have the tendency to hit first without checking their facts, just to make their point and hope the smear tactics will work. Lately, as you probably have noticed, thankfully, these tactics are f...

Ok Willie, I will, in fairness you must remember I was not even referring to my reasons for supporting the program, but I was incensed by the way the right chose to jump on this kid and his family by claiming to dig up information about them that has been proven to be false. The father does not own a highly profitable business. They do not have an income near what was claimed, and the kids are not going to outrageously expensive private schools paid for by the wealth of the family. Some on the right, have the tendency to hit first without checking their facts, just to make their point and hope the smear tactics will work. Lately, as you probably have noticed, thankfully, these tactics are finally beginning to backfire. I do not want to bring in other issues at this point because they do not relate to this particular issue.

I do believe the program is essential as there are many families who do not qualify for medicaid and simply cannot afford the premiums for private healthcare. Yes, there are some who will take advantage of the system inappropriately, but tell me of any program that exists for the good of the majority that is not manipulated by a small minority who are clearly dishonest. We cannot allow those legitimately in need to continue to suffer as we look for a fool proof program that just does not exist. I believe the way it is set up and the money involved is fair and accomplishes what it was set out to accomplish.

If we have 200,000,000 dollars for another supplement for the Iraq war, I am sure we can scrape up the additional funds over 10- years for these children who require medical care. It is just a matter of priorities, and as a member of the Republican party since 1968, I can tell you without hesitation, that this party has become far too removed from the needs of the disadvantaged and far too interested in corporate wealth and the military industrial complex, just as Eisenhower warned we might.

Be well my friend.

OH. OK. So, you are mired in the politics of the situation rather than the facts of it. I see. Perhaps you might want to obtain more objective sources to work your way through the propaganda. The fact, and it is not even disputed by the Dems, is that this child was coached and given a script. Also, What you say is not true is, in fact, absolutely true. The father admitted that he CHOSE not to acquire health insurance. That was risk he CHOSE to expose his family to. He admitted he could afford health insurance. He owns a home and a business property. He sends his child to private school. Why is public education below him, but not public health-care?

It seems to me we agree on this plan. H...

OH. OK. So, you are mired in the politics of the situation rather than the facts of it. I see. Perhaps you might want to obtain more objective sources to work your way through the propaganda. The fact, and it is not even disputed by the Dems, is that this child was coached and given a script. Also, What you say is not true is, in fact, absolutely true. The father admitted that he CHOSE not to acquire health insurance. That was risk he CHOSE to expose his family to. He admitted he could afford health insurance. He owns a home and a business property. He sends his child to private school. Why is public education below him, but not public health-care?

It seems to me we agree on this plan. However, it is evident it is more about politics and bashing Bush rather than actually getting a proper bill through congress.

I think what you need to understand is that this Bill was created in it's current form precisely so we would argue, play politics, and furhter divide the country rather than actually being responsible to those in need . The Left knew this Bill would be vetoed in the form it was sent, and rightly so. But, now that the GAMES are over, would you encourage your pathetic Left to actually send a Bill that is bipartisan and not simply a political stunt to rile up the pavlovian political Left?

Willie, I apologize if I mis-characterized your comments as politicized. As a disabled person, I spend a great deal of time listening and watching the news and reading all kinds of various publications both on and off line. It gets to the point that I am exposed to just about every line of thinking and disagreement that exists and I become somewhat hardened to having to explain myself in detail every time I form an opinion.

There are certain trigger words and expressions that get to me, and when you, or anyone else start telling me about typical left leaning mechanisms for manipulating opinions and then always fail to acknowledge the horrendous things the right has done and continues to d...

Willie, I apologize if I mis-characterized your comments as politicized. As a disabled person, I spend a great deal of time listening and watching the news and reading all kinds of various publications both on and off line. It gets to the point that I am exposed to just about every line of thinking and disagreement that exists and I become somewhat hardened to having to explain myself in detail every time I form an opinion.

There are certain trigger words and expressions that get to me, and when you, or anyone else start telling me about typical left leaning mechanisms for manipulating opinions and then always fail to acknowledge the horrendous things the right has done and continues to do for the same purpose, I immediately believe that the person I am conferring with has no real desire to understand my point of view, but merely wants to find ways to knock it down. I come across this on a daily basis.

Many of my friends and associates are conservative, and yet we seem to be able to discuss matters of differing opinions without ever making it personal, or insinuating motivations, without quite stating them as fact. I find a good number of people do that, and then when I respond, they will deny ever saying such a as this or that, which of course, is technically true, but the insinuations are just skin deep.

I am not saying you are doing this, I am simply stating why I occasionally react as I do. However, if you were to follow my many clips and comments, I believe you will find me to be a very open, honest and for the most part reasonable person.