It's interesting how people who would have no problem seeing how the phrase "to jew somebody down" is offensive don't see any problem with the phrase "to gyp".

Most linguists agree that "to gyp" is derived from the word "gypsy". Saying "oh, they shouldn't be offended, because we're not saying ALL gypsies steal" is like saying people shouldn't be offended by the phrase "that's so gay" because "I'm not saying that being gay is bad, I'm saying that the word 'gay' means 'bad, stupid, and worthless'!" It's like saying "Just because I use the word 'retarded' as an insult doesn't mean I have a negative opinion of retarded people!" Logically, that just doesn't work.

Using a word derived fro...

It's interesting how people who would have no problem seeing how the phrase "to jew somebody down" is offensive don't see any problem with the phrase "to gyp".

Most linguists agree that "to gyp" is derived from the word "gypsy". Saying "oh, they shouldn't be offended, because we're not saying ALL gypsies steal" is like saying people shouldn't be offended by the phrase "that's so gay" because "I'm not saying that being gay is bad, I'm saying that the word 'gay' means 'bad, stupid, and worthless'!" It's like saying "Just because I use the word 'retarded' as an insult doesn't mean I have a negative opinion of retarded people!" Logically, that just doesn't work.

Using a word derived from the name of a group of people as a slur or an insult implies that you see the group as negative. Why is that so hard for so many people to understand?

Is it really so important to continue using this word that you're willing to tell somebody "I don't care that you're offended and I don't care that you consider this to be insulting to you personally and insulting to your entire ethnic group, because my right to speak without thinking about the implications of my words is more important"?

Ok, example: very, very poor people live in the only tenement available. The tenements are considered slums. The owner or manager would be considered a "slumlord".

Are we disparaging poor people by calling this man a "slum lord".
The list goes on and on and on....I haven't used the word 'gypped' in years and I never knew it came from gypsies. Hell, I never knew a "gypsy" and I never met a "gypsy" either.Why in the world would Gypsies be disparaged? The ones in England that travel in their caravans do seem to tear up the local travel parks and steal from the local citizens. (according to the stories). Kinda matches what the judge was saying. Even if the shoe fits we still can wear it. Being...

Ok, example: very, very poor people live in the only tenement available. The tenements are considered slums. The owner or manager would be considered a "slumlord".

Are we disparaging poor people by calling this man a "slum lord".
The list goes on and on and on....I haven't used the word 'gypped' in years and I never knew it came from gypsies. Hell, I never knew a "gypsy" and I never met a "gypsy" either.Why in the world would Gypsies be disparaged? The ones in England that travel in their caravans do seem to tear up the local travel parks and steal from the local citizens. (according to the stories). Kinda matches what the judge was saying. Even if the shoe fits we still can wear it. Being PC is totally out of the loop now. Like I said earlier, we must go to the dark caves to speak.

@lakotahope:

Are we disparaging poor people by calling this man a "slum lord".

A "slumlord" is not merely a "landlord in a run-down neighborhood":

A slumlord (also spelled slum lord) is a derogatory term for landlords, generally absentee landlords, who attempt to maximize profit by minimizing spending on property maintenance, often in deteriorating neighborhoods...

Especially in the developed world, most landlords will properly maintain their properties even when doing so proves costly in the short term...

In contrast, slumlords do very little maintenance on their property (ordinarily, just enough to meet minimum l...

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@lakotahope:

Are we disparaging poor people by calling this man a "slum lord".

A "slumlord" is not merely a "landlord in a run-down neighborhood":

A slumlord (also spelled slum lord) is a derogatory term for landlords, generally absentee landlords, who attempt to maximize profit by minimizing spending on property maintenance, often in deteriorating neighborhoods...

Especially in the developed world, most landlords will properly maintain their properties even when doing so proves costly in the short term...

In contrast, slumlords do very little maintenance on their property (ordinarily, just enough to meet minimum local requirements for habitability), and in turn offer low rent rates to lure tenants who will not (or cannot) pay high rent (and/or who might not pass background checks should these be required to live in the higher rent areas). Slumlords of this kind typically prosecute many evictions.

"Slumlord" describes a person's actions, not their ethnicity nor the ethnicity or socio-economic status of those who live in the neighborhood. "Slumlord" is an insult directed at scumbags who prey on the poor and disadvantaged.

To "gyp" someone means "to treat them like a gypsy would", i.e. to cheat & steal from them.

Do you use the phrase To jew someone down to mean to bargain aggressively, if not unfairly?

Right! the "slum lord" is the culprit not the people in the tenement. Although we mean to disparage as much as possible the "owner" "Mgr" aka "slum lord" as much as possible we don't include the people living in the slums. It is only the one person with whom this moniker is attached. Just like the guy who 'gypped' those in ebay.
The judge got his point across. Remember, jews throughout mankinds history have been largely responsible for the banking and money management of citizens across the known world. If they seemed imperious to those who dealt with them, there probably was a reason. Generally, Jews have always been known to be successful in business dealings. Being a success in this, en...

Right! the "slum lord" is the culprit not the people in the tenement. Although we mean to disparage as much as possible the "owner" "Mgr" aka "slum lord" as much as possible we don't include the people living in the slums. It is only the one person with whom this moniker is attached. Just like the guy who 'gypped' those in ebay.
The judge got his point across. Remember, jews throughout mankinds history have been largely responsible for the banking and money management of citizens across the known world. If they seemed imperious to those who dealt with them, there probably was a reason. Generally, Jews have always been known to be successful in business dealings. Being a success in this, entails putting the screws to people in their dealings. Sometimes harshly and cruelly. But, even this, "being jewed down" can be a compliment. It is obvious there was a winner in someone being 'jewed down".

@Jorjor: You're correct about the suffix -man, but that's merely points to the fact that for much of our history, women weren't even considered eleigible for jobs/positions like those. It didn't need to be gendered because only one gender was in the running for the job.They reflect a certain historical mindset. But that's a side discussion.

I never knew it came from gypsies...

Probably along with most English-speaking people in the world. Remember, we're living in a climate where both "niggardly" and "black hole" were considered a racial slurs.

I would argue the degree to which the term "black hole" is considered racist. That's not a usage (or complaint about usage) I'...

@Jorjor: You're correct about the suffix -man, but that's merely points to the fact that for much of our history, women weren't even considered eleigible for jobs/positions like those. It didn't need to be gendered because only one gender was in the running for the job.They reflect a certain historical mindset. But that's a side discussion.

I never knew it came from gypsies...

Probably along with most English-speaking people in the world. Remember, we're living in a climate where both "niggardly" and "black hole" were considered a racial slurs.

I would argue the degree to which the term "black hole" is considered racist. That's not a usage (or complaint about usage) I've come across in ~38 years of English language use.

"Niggargly" does have an unfortunate epithet sound-alike, but it also has the advantage of a demonstrated linguistic provenance:

"Niggardly" (noun: "niggard") is an adjective meaning "stingy" or "miserly", perhaps related to the Old Norse verb nigla = "to fuss about small matters". It is cognate with "niggling", meaning "petty" or "unimportant", as in "the niggling details".

"Nigger" derives from the Spanish/Portuguese word negro, meaning "black", and probably also the French nègre, which likewise has become a racist insult in American culture, deriving from negro (the ordinary French word for "black" being noir). Both negro and noir (and therefore also nègre and nigger) ultimately come from nigrum, the accusative case of the Latin word niger, meaning "black".

The term "Gyp" meaning "to cheat/steal", less so. Especially since it refers to an ethnic minority with a history of persecution that continues to this day.

You're correct about the suffix -man, but that's merely points to the
fact that for much of our history, women weren't even considered
eleigible for jobs/positions like those.

I know I'm correct about the provenance of the suffix (and the word "man", too); I don't have degrees in linguistics and English grammar for nothing. However, I dispute your notion of where it points to. The genderization of "man" (in Old English "mann") came about because the original Old English words for "male person" and "female person" shifted their meanings and dropped out of common usage. As a word, it became associated with make, but continued in its neutral meaning as an affix, although in the...

You're correct about the suffix -man, but that's merely points to the
fact that for much of our history, women weren't even considered
eleigible for jobs/positions like those.

I know I'm correct about the provenance of the suffix (and the word "man", too); I don't have degrees in linguistics and English grammar for nothing. However, I dispute your notion of where it points to. The genderization of "man" (in Old English "mann") came about because the original Old English words for "male person" and "female person" shifted their meanings and dropped out of common usage. As a word, it became associated with make, but continued in its neutral meaning as an affix, although in the last hundred years, the semantics of the former was construed as impinging on the latter. It would be far different if English still had grammatical gender, but it only remains in the pronouns.

Those old words for "man" and "woman"? they were "ceorl" and "bryd" ("wif" and "cwen" were also used). They are now the words "churl", "bride" "wife" and "queen". It looks like the feminine side came out on the better end of that linguistic progression.

I would argue the degree to which the term "black hole" is considered
racist. That's not a usage (or complaint about usage) I've come across
in ~38 years of English language use.

It is if you're an African-American Dallas County comissioner or judge. And if Christians resent the Jews' involvement in finances, they have only themselves to blame. An early church position was that usury was against the bible, so Christians were forbidden from loaning money at interest - so who did that leave?