yep, me to - in Michigan. 50 degrees F on Christmas Day.

I always love these subjective arguments for global warming. The warmth we are experiencing is actually proof global warming is not happening... for about a dozen reasons, 2 of which are a) This season is unusually warm and global warming is not projected to have immediate effects, this is proof of anomoly and current pattern of warming trend we have experienced in the past several years. If a green house effect were heating the planet, the changes would not be noticeable this quickly (proof of anomoly). Also, tropospheric temperatures havce still not increased, this is required for a green-house effect. Third, ocea...

yep, me to - in Michigan. 50 degrees F on Christmas Day.

I always love these subjective arguments for global warming. The warmth we are experiencing is actually proof global warming is not happening... for about a dozen reasons, 2 of which are a) This season is unusually warm and global warming is not projected to have immediate effects, this is proof of anomoly and current pattern of warming trend we have experienced in the past several years. If a green house effect were heating the planet, the changes would not be noticeable this quickly (proof of anomoly). Also, tropospheric temperatures havce still not increased, this is required for a green-house effect. Third, ocean temps are actually cooler and hurricanes have decreased from last year.
It is at the point, every anomoly is blamed for global warming. Even the fact that ice at the poles have increased in bulk.

Well Funana, You have been misled. Yes climate is changing. That is what climate does.
First. The IPCC reports, which are the UN studies on climate and anthropogenic green house gases, state clearly they have "NO" eveidence of an anthropogenic green house house effect. Yet, the IPCC Summary for policy makers is a political document which misrepresents the report and is used by politicians and journalists to further an agenda.

Second, Surface temperatures are taken from locations around the Earth, which lead to false representation of actual global temps. For example over 80 % of climate stations are located in the Northern Hemisphere and are generally concentrated around metropolitan are...

Well Funana, You have been misled. Yes climate is changing. That is what climate does.
First. The IPCC reports, which are the UN studies on climate and anthropogenic green house gases, state clearly they have "NO" eveidence of an anthropogenic green house house effect. Yet, the IPCC Summary for policy makers is a political document which misrepresents the report and is used by politicians and journalists to further an agenda.

Second, Surface temperatures are taken from locations around the Earth, which lead to false representation of actual global temps. For example over 80 % of climate stations are located in the Northern Hemisphere and are generally concentrated around metropolitan areas.

Third, Satellite readings show tropospheric temps have not increased. This is a requirement for there to be a green house effect and proves our current warming is natural and not man-made.

Fourth, there is no consensus on global warming. There are many scientists that disagree with this hypothesis and many more joining. see oregon petition.

Fifth, 25 years ago most of these scientists hailed the coming of the next ice age. They've been wrong before, when they were certain they were right.

Keep your eyes open on this issue. I clip a lot about this. However, if you are only willing to look at one side. Your mind is already made up and you may not be interested in the facts.

AVERAGE temp is increasing at a quicker rate than it ever has in the
past, when it has taken tens of thousands of years to do so.

This is just NOT true. The Hockey Stick graph has been proven false and I don't even think Al Gore still touts it. Secondly, when climate shifts, it usually shifts in dramatic fashion. There is nothing man-made about global warming.

As far as you go Invictus... The one that is learning is YOU. You are not aware of the facts if you say that I am befinning to learn something. Sounds like you are stuck in your propaganda hype, and really not interested in others views. Sorry to hear that.

If you were more open-minded, you would more fully understan...

AVERAGE temp is increasing at a quicker rate than it ever has in the
past, when it has taken tens of thousands of years to do so.

This is just NOT true. The Hockey Stick graph has been proven false and I don't even think Al Gore still touts it. Secondly, when climate shifts, it usually shifts in dramatic fashion. There is nothing man-made about global warming.

As far as you go Invictus... The one that is learning is YOU. You are not aware of the facts if you say that I am befinning to learn something. Sounds like you are stuck in your propaganda hype, and really not interested in others views. Sorry to hear that.

If you were more open-minded, you would more fully understand my take on climate change, given the amount of comments I've made on it.

It's ironic to hear you talking about a "propaganda hype" or "being open-minded". You see the whole thing as a political conflict and tend to ignore all the facts and reports & researches.

It maybe unnecessary and unuseful to say this but I've been dealing with climate issues for five years now, have been an active member of CCNet (which also has many "nay-saying" members on climate change) and have had many correspondences with some climatology and oceanography institutes in this time period, including Woods Hole (WHOI), not to mention about 300 papers, reports and journal articles I have read and have been keeping in my archive in PDF format.

The truth is, our planet's climate is in an "...

It's ironic to hear you talking about a "propaganda hype" or "being open-minded". You see the whole thing as a political conflict and tend to ignore all the facts and reports & researches.

It maybe unnecessary and unuseful to say this but I've been dealing with climate issues for five years now, have been an active member of CCNet (which also has many "nay-saying" members on climate change) and have had many correspondences with some climatology and oceanography institutes in this time period, including Woods Hole (WHOI), not to mention about 300 papers, reports and journal articles I have read and have been keeping in my archive in PDF format.

The truth is, our planet's climate is in an "extra-ordinary change", like it had been in 1700 BCE, 5300 BCE or 9000 BCE - years that all came with catastrophic events around the world. The only uncertain thing is "what causes this change".

If you say "Human actions have little or no effect at all on all these climate activities", I'm gladly ready to talk and discuss this thing with you. If you say "Kyoto agreement is totally BS", I tend to agree with you. But if you insist "There is nothing wrong with climate", sorry, but I can't do anything other than express my strong disagreement.

The terminology and political agendas of both sides will cost humanity a lot, if we don't concentrate on "What to do" now. According to my view, this is not a "one-way" (like global "warming" or global "cooling") activity. This certainly is a situation where the climate and weather patterns on earth begin to "collapse" and act "weird". Like it had been numerous times in distant past of our planet.

So, keeping to discuss the political approaches and thesis will only cause the earth to lose very valuable time. The fact is, our climate will change soon (and have already begun changing) so what we need is to concentrate on "how to face this change" and what to do to protect our cities, agricultural lands, economy, social order etc. from the cat

You see the whole thing as a political conflict and tend to ignore all the facts and reports & researches.

Wrong again Invictus. I ONLY am concerned with the science, not flat-earth materialist philosophy disguised as science.
Whatever irony you find in my views is proof you are not subject to reality, as you have nothing on which to base irony. Unless it is your subjective presumptions that again are misguiding you. Which is proof of flawed thinking.
You are incorrigible, stuck in a pardigm that disallows the use of logic and science, instead renders consensus as an ideal, when the science suggests otherwise.
Continue living in 1491 if you want. There is still the the ...

You see the whole thing as a political conflict and tend to ignore all the facts and reports & researches.

Wrong again Invictus. I ONLY am concerned with the science, not flat-earth materialist philosophy disguised as science.
Whatever irony you find in my views is proof you are not subject to reality, as you have nothing on which to base irony. Unless it is your subjective presumptions that again are misguiding you. Which is proof of flawed thinking.
You are incorrigible, stuck in a pardigm that disallows the use of logic and science, instead renders consensus as an ideal, when the science suggests otherwise.
Continue living in 1491 if you want. There is still the the growing minority of us that prefer foundation and base our opinions on evidence and facts. For me truth is not a relative thing.