 masbury says: In other words, voters oppose things they've been told are in the reform bills that are, in fact, not there. This country is full of sheep. Ignorance is bliss. and we have been asleep at the wheel for far too long. Maybe questioning the proposed health care bill is better than accepting it hook, line and sinker? yes - the people you claim to support are just ignorant sheep. How dare they question their glorious overlords anyway. Funny you two never questioned your overlords Bush and Cheney. And your wrong on us not questioning Obama when he slips from the public option. We are nothing like you programed puppets. I am not for or against the health care bill, but I want to know just what we are getting ourselves into before agreeing to it. You, cptenaud, have apparently skipped this step. Instead you spend your time criticizing those who want to know more about the bill. Questioning it is excellent. Good sources abound for doing so in a matter of minutes. Unfortunately, bad sources abound as well, and the challenge is for Americans to learn to tell the difference. We are awash in right-wing exaggerations, and half the people who oppose Obama's proposals for reform do so on the basis of rumors spread by GOP strategists (eg, insuring illegals, paying for abortions, government takeover, government influence on length of life of older people - all pure blarney designed with the cynical intent of preventing democracy from working). Masbury: "bad sources abound as well," Speaking of... Coloradoright, I have found that the most uniformed are those who are rigidly self-assured and convinced they are right despite all evidence to the contrary. It is not the least bit surprising this is an NBC poll. Jay8h, The bill is available on line if you look for it. There are also watchdog groups outlining the problems with the bill. Jay8h/coloradoright, The bottom line is the fact that the entire Obama administration has expressed support for single-payer health-care. This bill is a sham. Americans don't want it. They know we have the best healthcare system in the world. Can it improve? Sure. Will this bill improve it? Everyone k... Yes, there are "watchdog" groups out there, making up shit that doesn't even have a passing resemblance of what's really in the bill, and getting controversial people to mention those lies, so it will stick in people's minds. In other words; they are lying scumbag traitors. If you're going to oppose the Healthcare bill, then at least oppose it for what is actually in there; not because the Prophet, Bill O'Reilly or the Messiah, Rush Limbaugh conned you into believing lies about it. The fact is; if the Left Wing tried even a fraction of the slimy techniques against a GOP-supposed bill when a Republican't was president, you'd have armed lynch-mobs roaming the streets, screaming for blood; and police standing aside to let them at whomever they were targeting at the time. The definitive term for the GOP is SLIME kenstipe, if I quoted the resources, you'd say, "Oh, you can't trust them," and return to those of your own bias. You've created a bullet-proof, truth-proof shield. Lifecycle, keep on saying the truth even if it seems like people reject it. The people who learn the most are often ones that read but choose not to comment. They are not so easily persuaded by the Limbaugh/Palin version. And to all: Neither death panels nor any such thing exist in these bills. They will not provide for illegals. They will not pay for abortions. Addition of another form of insurance beside those that exist is scarcely a government takeover of healthcare - since government won't be a healthcare provider AT ALL, but an insurance provider - utterly unlike the Canadian system. And Obama has said over and over that single-payer, while his favorite mode, is not right for America... Just like their types said the Civil Rights Act of 1964 would lead to black slavery because of what was in it ... Just like their types said that Medicare would mean certain socialism for America because of what was in it... So they now imagine new folk-tale paranoias. Men and women of good will must drum up their courage, endure the accusations of stupidity and naivete, and press on for the good of one another and the progress of America. I am so glad my heroes did not cave in to mis-informers' smears in '64 and '65, and I hope our generation can leave as much for the next. Kenstipe, America's healthcare system IS NOT the best in the world. Disabuse yourself of that notion right now. The US ranks a measly 37th in the world for healthcare, down among Third World nations. Anyone who says that America has the greatest healthcare system in the world is out to sell you something (usually overpriced, underachieving health insurance). Do you know who does have the greatest healthcare system in the world? France. It's a government-run Universal Healthcare system. The other top 19 consist of the other G20 nations, who all have government-run Universal Healthcare. The only G20 nation that doesn't have a healthcare system that ranks in the top 20 is the US,... To all: I have not known name-calling, insult-throwing, or snide wordplay to encourage real thoughtful discussion. Such practices may even cause an otherwise receptive reader to tune out and miss your point. I believe that the truth is, by its nature, strong enough to stand on its own, once spoken plainly. Clever invective may engorge the ego, or briefly relieve one's frustration, but it is a poor tool for persuasion. Masbury: "kenstipe, if I quoted the resources, you'd say, "Oh, you can't trust them," and return to those of your own bias. You've created a bullet-proof, truth-proof shield." Let's talk about who is creating a bulletproof truth shield when you presented an entire argument based on straw-man theorizing about what I might say about your sources and what you do say about mine. Why don't you not put words in my mouth and try a little harder at making your own words make sense. The difference is, Kenstipe, that Masbury uses unbiased sources, while your are well-known right-wing spin sites. Opinions do no count as facts. |
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