On a less harshly opinionated note, obviously this was not the beginning of male dominance. I find this article somewhat confusing in regards to the use of the word sex as opposed to the use of the word mating. Perhaps to the biologist, there is none. However I'm sure that the social or cultural anthropologist would make a distinction. The co-author sites that the findings support the theory that chimps can engage in long-term planning, anticipating future events and remembering past interactions. To me, this suggests that the more appropriate term to use would be mating. If this is the case, then what is being learned here has less to do with sex and reproduction and more to do with the abi...

On a less harshly opinionated note, obviously this was not the beginning of male dominance. I find this article somewhat confusing in regards to the use of the word sex as opposed to the use of the word mating. Perhaps to the biologist, there is none. However I'm sure that the social or cultural anthropologist would make a distinction. The co-author sites that the findings support the theory that chimps can engage in long-term planning, anticipating future events and remembering past interactions. To me, this suggests that the more appropriate term to use would be mating. If this is the case, then what is being learned here has less to do with sex and reproduction and more to do with the ability to use hindsight and foresight to determine behavior.

Complex relation and interaction my ass. This is where the male domination over females began and not a damn thing has changed. NOT A DAMN THING!

Wow. How deep! I had just the opposite feeling.

Not that women dominate, but in the sense that it is THEY who do the choosing (granted not in societies where men "own" their women, but in societies where women are free and have the same rights as men).

The courtship is generally the male trying to convince the female he is a better suitor than her other choices (which is anyone who wants to try).

I'm curious what you would find suitable in a partner if they didn't have those qualities (of sharing their possessions or winnings ...

Complex relation and interaction my ass. This is where the male domination over females began and not a damn thing has changed. NOT A DAMN THING!

Wow. How deep! I had just the opposite feeling.

Not that women dominate, but in the sense that it is THEY who do the choosing (granted not in societies where men "own" their women, but in societies where women are free and have the same rights as men).

The courtship is generally the male trying to convince the female he is a better suitor than her other choices (which is anyone who wants to try).

I'm curious what you would find suitable in a partner if they didn't have those qualities (of sharing their possessions or winnings or similar acts of kindness). If they didn't show a particular caring about you personally, what criteria would you find suitable in a partner?

Hi Aces, I was in hopes that my second comment would clear that up, being that there was little depth in the first. I think that gifts for sex is very different from gifts for mating. The first requires short term thinking, the second, long term thinking. One thing that may confuse the issue is that men view sex and love more synonymously than what women do. When a man is initially attracted to a women, chances are pretty good that his first thoughts involve sex as opposed to questioning if she will make a good wife and mother. With women, it is more apt to be just the opposite. As far as what I would want in a partner, I would want the same as anyone. The first time a man brings me a gift ...

Hi Aces, I was in hopes that my second comment would clear that up, being that there was little depth in the first. I think that gifts for sex is very different from gifts for mating. The first requires short term thinking, the second, long term thinking. One thing that may confuse the issue is that men view sex and love more synonymously than what women do. When a man is initially attracted to a women, chances are pretty good that his first thoughts involve sex as opposed to questioning if she will make a good wife and mother. With women, it is more apt to be just the opposite. As far as what I would want in a partner, I would want the same as anyone. The first time a man brings me a gift however, I assume it's for sex because more than likely it is.
Now about the domination issue, you say that women get to choose. I say that women get to choose because men allow them to choose. I know this isn't a very popular way to look at this but the truth is that when push comes to shove, men get what they want. Of course a man's actions towards women is dictated by a doctrine of civility. If you throw that doctrine out the window and go back to basics, man totally dominates. I give men a lot of credit for choosing to be civil because for them it really is a choice.

You had an interesting comment Aces, and I hope you don't mind me jumping in and giving MHO.
Sometimes I think people make too much about gender, ya know, the roles men and women are supposed to play in our society.
On a humanistic level, lovemaking isn't good unless both people choose it, don't you think?
Again, I know you didn't ask me, but if I had to list my qualities in choosing a partner, they would be quite different from when I was a young woman in my early adulthood. I like to joke that my only criteria was OMG, they had to be male and cute. But then, that was more about peer status and my expectations of a female in society than anything else.
My choice in a partner now w...

You had an interesting comment Aces, and I hope you don't mind me jumping in and giving MHO.
Sometimes I think people make too much about gender, ya know, the roles men and women are supposed to play in our society.
On a humanistic level, lovemaking isn't good unless both people choose it, don't you think?
Again, I know you didn't ask me, but if I had to list my qualities in choosing a partner, they would be quite different from when I was a young woman in my early adulthood. I like to joke that my only criteria was OMG, they had to be male and cute. But then, that was more about peer status and my expectations of a female in society than anything else.
My choice in a partner now would be very different based more on my sexual preference. But that person would have to be loyal, intelligent, thoughtful, and caring It ain't about looks or money.

@chestnut501

When a man is initially attracted to a women, chances are pretty good that his first thoughts involve sex as opposed to questioning if she will make a good wife and mother.

Ah, that depends entirely on the "type" of attraction. For instance, I may think Pam Anderson is (was) hot, and think of her sexually, but she would be among the last I'd consider for a wife or mother. (You can appreciate that, right?)

On another hand (and I don't know if I'm describing this right, but) it depends greatly on which woman I feel "strongly" about protecting.

And it's not a sexual thing at all, its a completely different type of attraction, something more important than sex; so...

@chestnut501

When a man is initially attracted to a women, chances are pretty good that his first thoughts involve sex as opposed to questioning if she will make a good wife and mother.

Ah, that depends entirely on the "type" of attraction. For instance, I may think Pam Anderson is (was) hot, and think of her sexually, but she would be among the last I'd consider for a wife or mother. (You can appreciate that, right?)

On another hand (and I don't know if I'm describing this right, but) it depends greatly on which woman I feel "strongly" about protecting.

And it's not a sexual thing at all, its a completely different type of attraction, something more important than sex; someone you really have a heart for. (The kind that sex could actually mess up.)

And there are others, still.

Consider, I've been head over heels with several women and actually had some as girlfriends, but would not consider as a viable wife, let alone the mother of my kids.

So note: sex and/or motherhood are not the only considerations in a sought-after relationship.

As far as "mating"? Sometimes that can simply take the path of least resistance.


@debbyski

On a humanistic level, lovemaking isn't good unless both people choose it, don't you think?

Absolutely.

My choice in a partner now would be very different based more on my sexual preference.

As chestnut501 points out, there's a difference between sex and mating. Your sexual preferences may have changed, but did your mating preferences?