So, are we supposed to believe that possessing such items makes you a criminal? You could find over half of the items on that list in my house, too. (No homemade caltrops or "wrist rockets," whatever those are, nor buckets of urine, though.) Please. These folks think the populace is so stupid that they list "flammable liquids" and "rags" as evidence of intent to commit a crime? Who doesn't own flammable liquids and rags? It's like those cases where the cops in the UK issued press releases describing people has possessing "bomb-making supplies" when it turned out that what they had was actually nail-polish remover. Yes, you can use nail-polish remover as an ingredient in homemade plastic expl...

So, are we supposed to believe that possessing such items makes you a criminal? You could find over half of the items on that list in my house, too. (No homemade caltrops or "wrist rockets," whatever those are, nor buckets of urine, though.) Please. These folks think the populace is so stupid that they list "flammable liquids" and "rags" as evidence of intent to commit a crime? Who doesn't own flammable liquids and rags? It's like those cases where the cops in the UK issued press releases describing people has possessing "bomb-making supplies" when it turned out that what they had was actually nail-polish remover. Yes, you can use nail-polish remover as an ingredient in homemade plastic explosives. Does that mean that everyone with a bottle of acetone in their house should be treated as a criminal?

Or do they actually have real, concrete evidence that something violent was being planned? You do realize there's a difference, right?

And before you start again with the rhetoric about how "if the 9-11 terrorists were captured before the fact, you would have been upset about that too" ... remember, conspiring to kill people is a bona fide crime. If they apprehend someone on the basis of evidence that they are planning something specific, I am perfectly OK with that. Intimidating people because you think they are capable of being "disruptive" as you put it in a prior clip, and taking as evidence the fact that they've got pipe, duct tape, plastic buckets, and Kryptonite locks lying around the house, is different, in my view.

I suspect that the next thing you'll tell me is that my outrage is selective. Before you tell me that yet again, maybe you could give some specifics. What would you like me to get outraged over that I'm missing? And if I did, would your opinion on these issues suddenly change?

BTB-
Again, Caltrops are only used for ONE purpose.

And 'shooting stars' (We assume you meant to type trowing stars) can be laid flat and run over or even walked on without injury. Caltrops simply cannot. This is by design. Maybe you are not familiar with what a Caltrop really is? And why people use them? Please do not try to explain away the 'rights of the individiual' in this case as it does not apply when anarchy tools are seized as evidence. Peaceful protest does not involve the use of tools of anarchy and destruction.

A caltrop (calthrop, jack rock, star nail, crow's foot or partisan nails) [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C...

BTB-
Again, Caltrops are only used for ONE purpose.

And 'shooting stars' (We assume you meant to type trowing stars) can be laid flat and run over or even walked on without injury. Caltrops simply cannot. This is by design. Maybe you are not familiar with what a Caltrop really is? And why people use them? Please do not try to explain away the 'rights of the individiual' in this case as it does not apply when anarchy tools are seized as evidence. Peaceful protest does not involve the use of tools of anarchy and destruction.

A caltrop (calthrop, jack rock, star nail, crow's foot or partisan nails) is a weapon made up of two (or more) sharp nails or spines arranged in such a manner that one of them always points upward from a stable base (for example, a tetrahedron). Caltrops serve to slow down the advance of horses, war elephants, and human troops. It was said to be particularly effective against the soft feet of camels.[1] In more modern times, caltrops are used against wheeled vehicles with pneumatic tires. In Japan such devices were known as makibishi. The device shares its name with the caltrop, Tribulus terrestris (Zygophyllaceae), whose spiked seed case can also injure feet and puncture tires. It can also be compared to the Star thistle, Centaurea calcitrapa, whose Latin name calcitrapa means "foot trap".

I know what a military-made caltrop is... however, a what counts as a "homemade" caltrop? Maybe a twisted-out-of-shape wire hanger? After all, as I remarked earlier, it's well documented that the cops have described homes with nothing more dangerous than nail polish remover (acetone) as storing "bomb-making chemicals." And as far as the urine goes, well, not to share too much here, but because my doctor wants to evaluate me for a kidney condition, I also had a pretty large jug of urine in my house for a while last week.

The point here isn't that these dudes weren't assholes, or troublemakers, or whatever. Maybe they did want to cause some kind of "disruption" as willhelm put it. The fact i...

I know what a military-made caltrop is... however, a what counts as a "homemade" caltrop? Maybe a twisted-out-of-shape wire hanger? After all, as I remarked earlier, it's well documented that the cops have described homes with nothing more dangerous than nail polish remover (acetone) as storing "bomb-making chemicals." And as far as the urine goes, well, not to share too much here, but because my doctor wants to evaluate me for a kidney condition, I also had a pretty large jug of urine in my house for a while last week.

The point here isn't that these dudes weren't assholes, or troublemakers, or whatever. Maybe they did want to cause some kind of "disruption" as willhelm put it. The fact is, though, that if all the evidence we have is a random list of objects collected from their house, then that doesn't prove intent to commit an actual crime. Unless they actually owned something that's against the law to possess, then it doesn't seem to me that they committed a bona fide crime. As I said earlier, I'm sure if the cops decided I were a threat and scoured my house, they could come up with a similarly menacing-sounding list.

History tells us that the authorities will always find a way to lock up people they think are troublesome, whether or not they've actually broken the law.